Starting an agency at just 17! With Tomasz Dyl, Founder and Managing Director of GottaBe! Marketing

In this week’s episode of The Beautiful Business Podcast we were delighted to welcome Tomasz Dyl, Founder and Managing Director of GottaBe! Marketing to talk about his experiences of starting an agency at just 17 years of age!

Our host Yiuwin Tsang talks to Tomasz about his experiences in starting out very young, taking risks and learning from mistakes, which has helped build a strong and resilient business today. They discuss how the drive to overcome obstacles and see results kept Thomas going as he tried to bridge the gap between Polish and UK communities and offer unique services in a niche market.  

Listen to the podcast to hear more about: 

• The importance of inclusivity in marketing, particularly in reaching ethnic minority communities in the UK
• The benefits of being an "upstart" brand, open to new ideas and able to adapt to change
• The importance of finding the right people for the right roles in a growing business, especially those who can empathise with the target market
• The importance of being part of the EDI (Equity, Diversity, and Inclusion) movement and making a difference in people's lives

About Tomasz Dyl

Tomasz founded GottaBe! Marketing, in 2008 and over the years has established it into a leading marketing agency, specialising in providing innovative and tailored marketing solutions to clients in various industries.

In 2022, Tomasz was awarded the ‘Business Leader Award’ at the 2022 South Coast Business Awards, presented to leaders who elevated their business or supported the local community. GottaBe! were also nominated for a further two awards: Small Business of the Year and Business Leader of the Year and in 2023 won ‘Independent Agency of the Year’ at the GG2 Leadership & Diversity Awards.

Transcript

Disclaimer: The following transcript is the output of an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors.   Every possible effort has been made to transcribe accurately. However, neither Beautiful Business nor The Wow Company shall be liable for any inaccuracies, errors, or omissions.

Yiuwin Tsang  

Welcome to the Beautiful Business Podcast. This week we are tallking to Tomazs Dyl, Founder and Managing Director of GottaBe! Marketing. Well, let's start with a bit of background, let's understand a little bit more about you what your background was before you started got to be at the tender age of 17.

Tomasz Dyl  

Yeah, it's great question to kick things off. I mean, I started at the age of 16, working in a coffee shop, and it was at the service station. And I knew this is not where my life's going to be. So I soon realised that I need to do something about it. And I've always been passionate about marketing, always been passionate about PR, and wanting to do something that's going to make a difference and be visible. Because obviously, as much as seven coffee is delightful, and people love it, it doesn't really make a change to your life. So I wanted to do something that's going to make a difference. And since I arrived, in the UK, at the age of 13, I barely spoken English. And I just saw this polish massive migration coming into the UK. And I thought that might be a need for somebody who's able to kind of build a bridge between the two communities and help them better to work together. And that's where the idea of the agency came about is about being able to introduce the communities to different brands, and for brands to really identify the different 14 T that there is out there, they can do something with it. So that's really the beginning. So we started offering our services towards a Polish community simply translating to start with booking some Polish media. So nothing really different of what you would normally do, but just more focused on a specific community.

Yiuwin Tsang  

Fabulous. So you moved to the UK when you were 13. And then you were working in the coffee shop and up and you thought this isn't this isn't a lie for you to kind of go on? What I mean, what what kind of background Did you did you start the agency straight off the fact that you didn't like, you know, go and spend some time working with an agency or you know, getting like a an internship or anything like that you went straight into it?

Tomasz Dyl  

Yeah, I mean, that would be too focused. And that would be to kind of structured, I followed the the philosophy of Richard Branson, screw it, let's do it. So you know, what's the worst thing that can happen. And if you don't give a go, you've missed out on 14 T, we've gave a go and it didn't work out, at least you gave it a go. So yeah, for me, it was very much of let's just jump into it and do it. I didn't have any experience, I didn't do an internship, I learned on the job. And literally screw it, let's do it. So it was quite a rocky road. It wasn't unfortunately, a very smooth journey at all times. But I think by making those mistakes and made me stronger, and later on in the business, I realised that if I actually probably had experience from a different agency would have been a very different world. But because I had to learn everything from the very beginning, it's given me a good kind of concrete based on what we do and how the business was built.

Yiuwin Tsang  

Fantastic. And I mean, like, you know, 15 years further down the line clearly, you know, it didn't didn't turn out too badly. So far anyway, and much to come, I'm sure. Do you feel like you're your background and the fact that you know, you've moved into a country 13 years old, so you've it's not like you're at an age where, you know, you were unaware of what was going on, there was some significant upheaval for you to, you know, move from from from Poland over to the UK? And do you think that that, that put you in good stead or did that kind of you know, I suppose, give you that resilience almost and the the bravery to start up an agency into something that you hadn't done before, because you spotted the opportunity?

Tomasz Dyl  

Definitely, I mean, the fact that obviously, I arrived in the UK with very little English or almost no English. And being chucked into a school where everybody spoke English, I was forced to learn it. But at the same time, when I started a business, it was almost the same thing. But just in a different scenario. I had to learn what my marketing was all about. I had to kind of think about on my feet, what we're going to do, that's going to be different to what all of the other companies are offering. Our niche was the fact that we were able to open doors to the Polish community and be able to really go into the specifics of the community. I have the background in terms of knowing how brands are currently doing it and not doing it too well. I also knew what the Polish community wanted and how it's, you know, the new On sets of reaching out to the community, so I've kind of combined my living experience, not very long living experience more of like a, you know, kids experience. But I've observed, obviously different people's lives and etc. And that's given me a good enough Headstart to then starting to think what we're going to do, and how are we going to run that. And like I've mentioned, you know, it wasn't an easy journey, there was a lot of obstacles. I think back in the day, when I was starting the business, not only was it credit crunch, everybody was cutting down the marketing spend. I don't think businesses were as open to very young people are starting their own businesses. 15 years ago, it was more about the age, the connections and the experience that you had, whereas now I think we're very much more opened to very young people, challenging businesses, opening business at a very young age, and being the kind of the, you know, the challengers, whereas back then a, it was more about the kind of traditional old school way. So, you know, my age was also a barrier, my language was a barrier. And the fact that I was it in a very niche market was a barrier for a lot of companies. That

Yiuwin Tsang  

I mean, they're like huge barriers, Thomas to have to kind of face as a 17 year old as well. And the most of the moments when you just thought, Oh, this is really, really hard. And you know, and as you mentioned, you mentioned a couple of times, just in the first few minutes of this call, that it hasn't been a smooth ride all the way through. And there have been some bumps in the road as such, and what, what, what got you over those bumps? What was what was the driving force behind it? What kept you going? Because I'm, you know, I'm not, I'm not not being funny here. But there are certain minerals out there who would would would probably give up quite, quite quickly, and perhaps would would, would would, you know, wouldn't wouldn't quite have that kind of grit and resilience? What do you think, got you got you through and over these things.

Tomasz Dyl  

Thank you. For me, the main thing is, is I'm not a person that gives up very easily, I will give a good go at it before I will say you know what, this is not working. And I think if I was listening to my family, and really taking on their advice, I probably would have given up probably four or five weeks into it. So I think as much as my family was very supportive and keen for me to do it, at the same time, they knew I was going to come across a barrier, at some point, I'm going to have to do something about it. But for me, I'm a very hard working and very focused person. And I see a challenge, I want to overcome that challenge. And I want to come out the other side, and I said, I have a solution for it. So for me the rewards, were seeing brands doing well independent community people, you know, using their products and services. And as much a lot of people said, you know, you're not making a huge difference to these companies, I felt I was doing a big difference. Because I saw a bigger uptake, more people signing up to services, buying the product. So for me, that was a reward. And seeing results is always something that got me through various things. So being driven by results definitely has been a big part of it.

Yiuwin Tsang  

populism and that's the sort of thing that you can't, you can't really argue, can you when it results when statistics when it's data, and that sort of thing, that, that, that that you can't kind of take away, I also have to take, I also read as a sense of pride as well, Thomas, in terms of, you know, this, this, this piece about introducing brands to the Polish market. I know that you know, given your your background, given your family, given your experience and come into the UK, that gives you quite a unique kind of perspective to it. But am I right in thinking that that there was this? There was a How can I articulate this there was this piece of it sounds like there was a piece of inclusion that comes into this as well, where perhaps, you know, communities such as the Polish community and other other communities that exist in the UK, where they are, whether deliberately or not, but kind of overlooked by brands or certainly not focused upon as much as am I right and sensing this, this this kind of pride in your work? Absolutely,

Tomasz Dyl  

yes. I mean, their ethnic minorities and not just polish communities across the country. We have 14 point 6 million ethnic people living in the UK, and only one in five brands currently reaches out to them. So there is a huge work still to do. And when I started running this business 15 years ago, as their statistics were even worse, those numbers were even lower. So yes, certainly, for us as a business it's always been about education about making a statement but equally introducing something Different. And we're not asking them to reinvent the wheel, we're just asking them to say, here's a wheel and we can introduce you to a different community, which might not be necessarily watching or reading the, you know, traditional media that they need the different touch points and they needed a different forms of communications. And that's what we've always have done. That's how we started with the Polish community. Once we kind of cracked a Polish community, we moved on to a different ones and we're now servicing our clients in 46 different languages and, you know, focusing on not just the Polish community, but all of our communities across the country. And it definitely is a pride moment, it's great to see that, you know, your work has helped certain brands to overcome a whether that's a quality or whatever, that is equity challenge and for us, we always say if we can make a 1% difference, that is a big chunk because we know that 1% really means 10% to other people, and for some will actually mean 25 30% So we are a challenges and we are on the journey to make that change and we want to change and we've always been changing that since day one.

Yiuwin Tsang  

That's again fabulous fabulous and and it comes back to what you mentioned before Thomas around being the challenger brand being you know the plucky upstart, you know,

Tomasz Dyl  

it's on the blog. Yeah, indeed.

Yiuwin Tsang  

But but there's there's there's there's real, there are real positive attributes to being you know, that that upstart, as you say it's that being open to new ideas, new interpretations, it's been able to deal with change and not like be so railroaded in tradition or convention. You mentioned how prior to the credit crunch things were, things were quite set in their ways. And I think part of that is because, you know, agencies, big agencies, that buyers and marketing departments within larger corporations and things like this, they wouldn't get sacked for doing what they always did you know that there was no kind of real benefit for them to pop the head above the parapet and do something different other than if it went wrong, they would be in for the chop. So I think having that attitude having that approach of being, you know, new of being open of being innovative isn't isn't a bad thing. That's no, it's also really important to keep a hold of as you as you grow and evolve over well over 15 years, there's got to be has has been going. And 15 years is a really impressive time to be in business. Let's not kind of shy away from that. What's been your highlight so far? What what what what in your work has given you give me real joy.

Tomasz Dyl  

Now severals rewards, I would say, first of all, we have a very loyal base of clients. We have clients that we've been working for 15 years. And they're big brands, big financial services brands that we're very proud to be working with. So that's the thing, number one. Number two is seeing the changing landscape of the marketing. But also marketing is opening themselves more towards the EDI into what we do. And we've been running our EDI event, which for most people stands for equality, diversity inclusion. For us, it stands for everyone doing it together. So it's our annual conference that we host. And seeing that growing in numbers and also in participants and in the brands that are expressing interest is a huge win, and also something that we can tangibly say that we are making a difference to that 110 20% I said earlier, and I think for my team to really change and for my team to really get behind what we do. So we come from different walks of life. And we have a very diverse team of people. But I'm very proud, especially of my British colleagues, who obviously, you know, I'm now working with a lot of ethnic communities and for them to change the mindset to say actually is important to communicate in different languages communicating different means, you know, your your message that you're going to be putting out on ITV is not always going to hit 100% of the people you need to be where the audience's is. And it's really rewarding to see that they've understood this and then now challenging their clients to say, Look, you want this product in people's hands, but actually you're going after the wrong media or you're putting this in the wrong places. Let me fix that for you. So that's for me is a big deal. When and I think, ultimately for the fact that we're growing as a business, for the 15 years, we've been growing year on year, and being able to serve as more clients and more industries, especially around EDI products and services is super important for us because we are making a change, and we're working towards more inclusivity in media and marketing. And that's, it's something that we're super proud of. And

Yiuwin Tsang  

so it should be and I guess, like, again, it's it's proof proof in the pudding, if your business is growing, then you are having more of an impact, you're servicing more brands, who want to do more work and being inclusive, and in reaching out to a more diverse group of of customers, consumers and clients. I mean, that's, that's phenomenal. And, and that piece around your team as well, Thomas that same that's really good to hear as well, in terms of I suppose that that fulfilment, I guess that your your team members will have and not only that, by the expertise and their and their knowledge and and the advice that they're able to give to clients by Imagine, again, comes back to that source of pride as well. And the passion.

Tomasz Dyl  

And the challenge we have in the sort of ethnic marketing, multicultural marketing is is not being taught at the university or anywhere else. So we are having to train everybody from scratch, in order to, you know, get more people into our industry. So as much as we want to scale, we are blocked. And we are sort of facing a challenge by the fact that there is no enough people out there who know what ethic marketing and multicultural marketing is. So in order to scale, we need to be able to bring people in train them. And that takes time. So we are also working with universities and other training providers to see how we can elaborate on that and give our perspective and try to get more people into this industry so that when not just the challenges that in the future, the bigger agencies are able to also equally offer our products and services in that same space as us. But there is more of a pool of people that we can call up on. And just going back to your previous question in terms of something else that we're proud of. Recently, one of our clients said, because you've been doing such a wonderful work in the UK, we now want you to start thinking about doing the same work in other markets for us. So I think it's we're not longer just changing the UK and the Irish landscape. We're now also in the Nordics. And we're now being challenged to do the same and deliver the same great work in other countries. So think, again, they've seen the return on investment, they see how important it is, and they want us to go out and do it in other markets.

Yiuwin Tsang  

That is very exciting. Really exciting. So what's been the early kind of what's been the early observations that you've made of looking at these new markets? I guess societally? Well, if we think about the Nordics, for example, it's a very different kind of culture, I would imagine, and the kind of consumer trends that are out there, what have you spotted as a as an early kind of indicator?

Tomasz Dyl  

We're doing a lot of work at the moment, I'm actually going out there in a couple of months, just to see how the market is itself. But yes, I mean, as you've mentioned, culturally, very different. Both the media landscape is very different. But ultimately, it's about finding the people that they want to reach out to, and listen to them and find out what are their challenges and how we can overcome those. So that's ultimately what we're doing now is speaking to various community leaders, key people of influence, to identify what are the challenges they're facing, and how we can help to solve those challenges, and how we can work with them to make a change. But ultimately, it's still the same thing. It's about reaching out the hard to reach audiences. And our job is to find those audiences for our clients and help them to communicate and deliver them their message.

Yiuwin Tsang  

That's phenomenal. And from a from a business perspective, I guess we've got to be that's like a wonderful roadmap of growth, I suppose in terms of So you started off with a polar community, you crack that, as you mentioned, then you expand to different communities in the UK. So you'd have that kind of roadmap, you have that model, you have those systems and processes. And then it's a case of moving it out into different markets and looking at what you need to tweak what you need to adjust for the different variances, I guess in a different markets that you approach.

Tomasz Dyl  

Absolutely. I mean, we've been doing international campaigns for clients for some time, but it's always been more of a one off project here and there whereas With this particular brand, they want us to take this over on a more permanent basis. So we are going to be the ones driving force and you know, shaping, ultimately their future in that country and their growth in that country as well. So it's important for us to get it right. And it's important for us to take our time to ensure that we have got the right people. But ultimately, the right key points of difference that we can take back to our clients. And this is, these are their challenges that they're facing. And this is what we need to solve. And this is how we're going to do it. But like you've mentioned, we were growing, we are not just growing in the UK, but when they were growing on a sort of more international basis to

Yiuwin Tsang  

that's, that's so it's so exciting. It's great to hear the stories and your experience of doing it. And you're up to 13 staff now, is that right? Thomas?

Tomasz Dyl  

Yes, 13. At the moment, we are looking for the 14. And then in obviously in the new year, we're also going to be looking at more and more people.

Yiuwin Tsang  

Fabulous. And again, more people more capacity, more client more client work, more impacts, because again, you know that that whole kind of that inclusionary piece, but getting to 13 and itself isn't a no mean feat. And when you reflect on that growth, as you grew from just you to two of you three, five, up to 10 out of 13. Were there. Were there any kind of inflection points during that journey that really stand out? In your mind? Were there any points where you thought, oh, okay, how we did it before, isn't going to work? Now, you know, because, you know, the first one, obviously, going from just you to having somebody else is a big change. But were there any others on that journey to 13.

Tomasz Dyl  

I think growing our presence across two offices has been a big challenge, because we are not just in Southampton, but we're also in London and Dublin and being able to manage somebody remotely was definitely a challenge. So I think finding the right people in various locations, other than our home base, or just Southampton has been that challenge. So our country manager in Ireland, that's definitely been a challenging role to find, by the same time to find somebody who you can trust and you're not gonna see them other than a couple of times a week was a different challenge. And equally, I think, when we, like I've mentioned before, because we're growing and finding the right people who come with experience in ethnic marketing and multicultural marketing is super challenging because you ultimately have to poach them from your competitors, or you have to train them because there's just no other way of finding them. It's not like he can even look recruit in other country and get them to come over, because they need to understand the British market just as much as they understand their own markets. So definitely has been a challenge of finding the right people. But I think the role that really stood out in those years is finding a client manager, who's able to understand both our market in terms of who we targeting, but ultimately understand the importance of it. And being a British person in this role wasn't necessarily a very easy, but he ticked all the boxes for us from that perspective, and being able to not just learn about the importance of everything marketing, how it works, but equally be able to translate that into every conversation he's having with a client. So that for me, I think it's one of those roles that really stood out. And I think you know, every time we look to work with a different community, finding the white person who's gonna give us that insight is super important because from that person in really starts the relationship of Dan growing this on a much bigger scale. Yeah,

Yiuwin Tsang  

that's really interesting. Pull that out your client, client manager has been one of the key roles in your in your growth and the remote worker thing we can come back onto as well because that that's the challenges faced a lot of businesses obviously, it's interesting to kind of post COVID But I suppose to be remote is one thing to be literally on an island, different island is, is is another thing altogether. And but just to come back to your client manager piece, it's quite interesting to whether you articulate there somebody who could somebody who could empathise with your target kind of markets through their client as well. So there's understand the client landscape, understand the community that the client is looking to engage with. And then also understand the business that internal got to be functionality, benefits services and things like that, and then able to communicate almost across or understand and certainly have an appreciation of all three elements. Is it am I am I kind of articulating that Okay, so yeah, you're spot on. Yeah, and finding people like that is difficult. It's not a rare breed, there

Tomasz Dyl  

is an interesting story where this particular individual, because it wasn't necessarily the role they got hired for. But we soon realised that this person was actually sort of almost, you know, killing themselves in the role they hired for, and they were screaming, hey, I can do a lot more. So we did push this back and forth for a lot more. And that's where, by sort of accident, though, in a way, we found them in a role where they're really good, and they excelling. And like you've mentioned, they've been able to build their own bridge between different connections between different stakeholders, and been able to really work that well. So that's, you know, we, our purpose to say is to build a bridge between the community and the brand. And I think, in every relationship we work with, and every stakeholder, we always build a bridge. So in order to kind of get through those bridges, you sometimes need to kind of get somewhere new thing, actually, that road is almost finished, I now, I'm now in charge of building the next chapter of the bridge, and I need to build that bridge. So that is very important. And it's something we constantly say to our colleagues is, you know, you didn't come to the end of the bridge, that part of the bridge hasn't been building, you need to build it now. So you need to Brick by Brick starting to build those relationships and get that

Yiuwin Tsang  

fabulous. That's a lovely way of putting it as well, by the way, Thomas, I really like that, in terms of building building, because we can visualise it. Yeah, I love it, I really, really do. And that example of the client managers is fabulous as well sounds like you, you took on the right person for the wrong role. And you just you've discovered the right role for them. And now you have the right person in the right role. And it's

Tomasz Dyl  

not the only example that I can think of, I think we need to think about our recruitment, I think we've not necessarily hired the wrong people for the wrong roles. But we've soon realised that they're actually be better suited in a different role. And I think when you're scaling a business, you can you have got that flexibility of being able to say, you know, what, that hasn't worked out for you, or, actually, you're wasted in that role. Let me put you in this role and find somebody else who can take this role from you. And that's in the last two years, we've been doing this all the time, we found somebody, we really liked them, but actually soon realised that this person would be better suited elsewhere in the business and, and sort of almost build a brand new role for them, and push them towards it whilst then recruiting for the other role.

Yiuwin Tsang  

So it's interesting that you mentioned in the last couple of years, and this has happened, so am I right in thinking that the last couple of years have been quite a fight. quite exciting for your for your agency?

Tomasz Dyl  

Yes, both COVID and Blacklegged movement have been a very important dates or key issues that have happened and really shine a light for brands but equally for others to think about ethnic minority, so COVID, from the perspective of the impact it had on various communities. But because often, they also did the lower end jobs, that's been a lot more community has been impacted by the COVID. And the deaths and illnesses and longterm COVID are much bigger within the ethnic minorities than they are in certain markets. And then, obviously, the whole black life movement have really shone a light for a lot of brands that we need to do something about our EDI, we need to revisit our policies, and we need to do something. And that's where we have seen a massive growth as a result of those two, sort of, in a way incidents, I will say that have helped us to sort of piggyback on on the back of it. And the fact that you know, more and more people wanted to go and change roles after COVID has also given us a 14 to to look for fresh talent, new talent that wants to do something different, more impactful, more meaningful. And that's how we sort of started to get more people interested in the whole EDI space. And we've been able to find it a little bit easier to find individuals to join our team.

Yiuwin Tsang  

And it's and that's great, because of there's a demand for more capacity, more work, and you're able to find more talent to come and do that work. And that's, that's a wonderful kind of ecosystem going like that and just to kind of reflect a moment on, you know, COVID on black lives that are these like significant moments in history. And it's just really an it's just, I mean, there was so much horribleness that came out of that and what's kind of sprung to you know what kind of Grove You know, the Black Lives Matter movement are horrendous. And obviously, some of the some of the suffering that that took place during COVID is horrendous as well. And but for me, the biggest fear that I had, and lots of people shared was that things will go back to how they were. And but the fact that, you know, your agencies do too well, using this growth means that you know, popular is hope that things aren't. And that, you know, there is more emphasis on equity on inclusion, more diversity, which is, which is a really, really good thing. And to your point, and to come back again, around the growth that you've had, and hiring new people, and then bringing people in, who perhaps weren't, the role wasn't quite right for them. But it sounds like they were right for the business, they were right for the company. And having that flexibility, I guess, from an employer's perspective to have that insight to have that. And that opens the door to do to a degree, there's a humility to this as well, Thomas, I think in the sense that you've spent the time to put your job description together to put the rules responsibilities together, you spent, you invest the effort and everything else into it, advertise for the role, recruit for the role, select for the role, and then you go, Ah, maybe that wasn't the right role. I think it's good to be open and flexible to that.

Tomasz Dyl  

I think it comes with the fact that we are not necessarily as structured in a way as some bigger agencies, because I'd go back to the point of, you know, where I started screwing, let's do it. So we've never had proper sort of, you know, structure in place, then we have to have an HR person, we have to have a admin person, two salespeople, six account managers, etc. For us, it was more about what does the business demand? And what role do we need to create next, and if this person needs to do to kind of almost two people's jobs, for time being, let's see how we can work this. And then once the capacity increases, let's move this person to this particular role. And having that flexibility meant we could, you know, not necessarily hire the wrong people, or like II said, hire people, because we liked them. They, they felt right for us, but not necessarily for the role that they've been looked for. And, you know, not even long ago, we've had somebody who came for a job interview here, and there was for all that we haven't even advertised just yet we are you are preparing to it. And, you know, we've offered that person that particular role based on the fact that they came in for an interview for a different role, but we felt they would be suited somewhere else in the business. And we were right, they're much better in this particular role than what they were going for. So I think having flexibility in being able to adjust when you're small, or smaller, makes it easier, I think, if we were sort of a team, or 50, or 60, would be a very different scenario.

Yiuwin Tsang  

I think, I think that's something to remember for, you know, all the agency owners and founders that are out there that are growing, you know, perhaps they're, you know, a little bit behind you, perhaps they're sevens and eights, or whatever it might be. But, you know, there's a lot of benefit and not being too rigid, I guess is what this is, is having this, you know, a degree of flexibility in your approach, when you're building your team, that you can keep a hold of the superstars, you know, because the worry would be that, you know, you've got a superstar employee, and the role isn't fulfilling for them, it isn't right for them, and they go elsewhere. And so it's having that degree of flex actively a Slack built into your system, or at least being open to have that level of slack and flexibility to be able to flex to the to the people in the role. And I've got one last question for you, Thomas, if I may, just in terms of the end of this section, but and what what we've, we've spoken a lot about pride and the impact that the gotta be bringing to the world. What What for you? are you most proud of with your time so far with them got to be?

Tomasz Dyl  

Oh, has a tough question. There's a lot, have a go. I will try to keep it short and sweet. Which doesn't normally happen. But I'll try. I think for me, the biggest pride I have is running a business that is making a huge impact on people around us. Very often people that we don't know. But because they've seen communications or they've seen messaging for a particular brand we work with they come to us after they've realised that we do is communication say thank you. So it's not the client but it's the clients customer that comes to us and thanked us for you know, opening the doors or informing them in their native language that this product or service existed because really made their difference. So I think that's for me is the biggest reward is seeing our appliance customers really appreciate the effort that they go into in terms of communications. And I think the other element is for my team to really get behind and understand the purpose of our business. And also seeing the tangibility that we're bringing in and how this really makes a difference to people's lives is another big, proud moment for me. So I think it kind of both interconnects in the fact that we are opening doors to communities, and we're helping the community to discover different brands, that's the, you know, that's what really, for me is the proud moment. Of course, the fact that we have good relationships with clients that, you know, as long as our business which is 15 years. And the fact that we have worked on some award winning campaigns, and we've been given the opportunity to do videos is just as important. But actually making that difference in the community is super important. And this sort of links back to, you know, the movements that we've seen with Black Lives movement, you know, we've now seeing all the post COVID They're changing in the sort of communities and everything else. I would like to see were part of the EDI movement and were making a difference to people's lives. Who might have not had that chance to you know, otherwise.